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Today, Norm Goldman Publisher & Editor of Bookpleasures.com is excited to have as our guest Thomas White author of Justice Rules. Thomas is a veteran theatrical director and producer. He directed the world tour of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles-Coming Out Of Their Shells. He has written several screenplays and Justice Rules is his first novel.

Good day Thomas and thanks for participating in our interview

Norm:

I believe Justice Rules is your first novel. Did you enjoy the process? How was it different from writing screen plays?

Thomas:

Yes, Justice Rules is my first novel and I found the process both exhilarating and incredibly frustrating at the same time. The thrill of recognizing how the characters that you have created actually fit together to tell a story is amazing, however the process of re-reading and re-writing to get to that point can be maddening. I eventually learned that if I have written something that does not take me closer to the point I am trying to make, I cut it.

Sometimes I'll write two paragraphs trying to say what I mean to say and then edit it down to a single sentence that is more descriptive and succinct in its brevity than anything else I could have written. In Justice Rules, I wanted to show how the driver's of the Spokane community operated with a different mind set than those in Los Angeles. I must have written three or four paragraphs describing the many traffic infractions that occur on a daily basis. I finally realized that I was just bitching and cut it down to one sentence, "The pale-green Spokane County SUV traveled a steady five-miles an hour under the speed limit in the left hand lane."

This is one of my favorite sentences in the whole book. It does exactly what I wanted it to do and it is short and concise. I would not have gotten there however, without writing the four bitchy paragraphs first. Eventually, I ended up cutting over 60,000 words to get to the tight, concise version that is now published. I do not regret over-writing, it allowed me to keep the best parts and cut the fluff. It also allowed me to explore deeper into both character development as well as the story's twists and turns.

The experience of writing a novel vs. a screenplay could not be more different. With a novel you must write what you see in your head and make the reader understand, through the use of words, what you are seeing. You are responsible for the entire experience. With a screenplay you are using character and imagery to show the viewer the story. You write the action and dialogue while the director is responsible for the imagery. It can be frustrating not to be able to describe the type of environment you expect any further than, "Day - An Elegant Mansion - A few hours later." And then you get to add, "It is raining." Not exactly fulfilling words to a novelist. Switching hats is a tricky proposition and consequently, there are not a lot of people who do both.

Norm:

Can you share a little of Justice Rules with us and was its writing improvisational or did you have a set plan?

Thomas:

Justice Rules was inspired many years ago by the OJ Simpson murder trial. After the acquittal, I saw an interview with Fred Goldman, the father of Ron Goldman, the man OJ "allegedly" killed. The frustration and anger was evident in his body language and on his face. To know who was responsible for the death of his son and not have any recourse to find justice had to have felt terrible. His options were very limited and short of walking up on the court house steps with a gun, he had no place to turn.

If anything were to happen to OJ after the trial, every law enforcement agency in the country would be on Fred's doorstep in an instance. Then I thought, "What if it wasn't OJ? What if it was just some guy who hurt you or your family and then got away with it due to one judicial snafu or another? How far would you go in taking justice into your own hands and giving the assailant what he deserved?" This train of thought led me to wonder how to kill someone and get away with it. But, I thought, "How would you exact justice without paying to the very justice system that had failed you?" It was this string of questions that led to Justice Rules.

The ultimate question that is addressed in the novel is, "How far can you go before justice becomes revenge?" At the end of the day, Justice Rules is a novel about victims and how they survive life after they have survived a brutal and violent attack.

Norm:

What kind of research did you do before writing Justice Rules?

Thomas:

I did a lot of research into victim's help groups. I found a wide range of programs, all designed to help the survivors of a violent attack to carry on with their lives. As a society, the victim's plight has been homogenized for our own survival. We hear on the news that a child was "molested." That is all we really want to hear, we want to be able to imagine those details rather than hear the specifics. No one wants to hear about anal rape and savagery every bit as heinous. Consequently, we have become a bit immune to these tortures. In the book, I try to let the reader see these crimes through the eyes of the victims and allow the victims to decide how they are going to respond over the course of their lives. Some adjust and go on, others live in constant fear and then there are those who are not willing to sit back and live the life of a victim, they want justice wrought by their own hands.

Norm:

What was your main focus when you created your protagonist?

Thomas:

Brian Wylie is a top FBI profiler who was heading up the office in Los Angeles. He is highly respected and extremely effective in his job. His ex-wife moved to Spokane, WA with their daughter and, unwilling to become a two-weeks-in-the-summer dad, Brian transfered to the Spokane office.

The now erudite and worldly Brian Wylie is immersed into a small town, right wing world "...where people's idea of dressing up is wearing a ball cap free of sweat stains." Additionally, Brian has a deep seated fear of the woods. Naturally, the first murder that occurs in the book is in the mountains north of Spokane and Brian must trek out into the wilderness.

I imagine my main focus was on keeping him lighter than he would be expected to be, never forgetting that he has a sense of humor and making him extremely good at his job. I use the "fish out of water" situation to my advantage and am able to show the reader both sides of these lifestyles, the simple, slow paced life in Spokane compared to the sophisticated and worldly nature of Brian. Brian is an excellent father, capable of being a terrific friend and has a light and engaging personality and yet he has few friends and spends most of his time outside of work by himself. This is a result of his situation and environment which do not necessarily combine in a cohesive manner.

Norm:

What is your secret in keeping the intensity of the plot throughout Justice Rules?

Thomas:

Keeping this plot moving was not as difficult as I thought it would be. The analogy that I use to describe it is from Stephen King's "Tommyknockers." A woman is walking in the woods behind her home and stumbles over a small piece of metal protruding from the ground. Out of curiosity, and an morbid desire that eventually consumes her (it is Stephen King after all), she discovers that the small piece of metal was the tip of the rear tail of a space ship. That is how I approached this story. A murder in the woods - leads to the identity of the body - that leads to victims that the dead man had attacked - that leads to a world of intrigue, suspense and surprise. And of course, whenever I was stuck, someone had to die.

Norm:

Did you learn anything from writing your book and what was it? As a follow up, what was one of the most surprising things you learned in writing Justice Rules?

Thomas:

I learned an immense amount from writing this book. First off, how damn hard it is. Second, I learned that the journey is what is most important, and most exciting. Letting the story veer off into weird tangents and twists that sometimes never lead anywhere or produce anything of value allowed me to discover things about the characters and the story that ended up being vital to the final product. The most surprising thing for me was how i learned what the phase, "The characters wrote themselves" meant. Now, I am not a true believer in that necessarily, but, there were several times through the course of writing this book that one character or the other stood up and said, "Hey, I'm the one you're looking for. I'm the one that you were talking about in the beginning. Write more of me." There are several characters who were minor, ancillary parts in the first versions that turned out to be a very important part of the story; my antagonist actually developed in this manner. I love sitting down and heading off in a direction and seeing where that train of thought takes me. Often times I have to double back and toss the whole thought out but one thought leads to another and it may be the next thought that takes you where you need to go.

Norm:

In fiction as well as in non-fiction, writers very often take liberties with their material to tell a good story or make a point. But how much is too much?

Thomas:

When writing non-fiction I feel it is appropriate to edit the events to produce a readable story but the facts need to remain intact. Maybe a conversation that took place over several dinners is condensed to one, maybe an affair that happened in South America happens in Vegas, those types of adjustments do not bother me as long as the facts are intact. In fiction, well, you have no restrictions and can make up anything you damn well please. The more the merrier, as a matter of fact. In fiction, the only laws are the ones you create for your story. The better your imagination, the better the story will become. I tend to stick as close to reality and the truth as possible. While I am writing fiction, it is usually based on something I know or something I have felt. I did invent a branch of the FBI, the Terrorist and Violent Crime Sector, in Spokane. While it is an actual branch of the FBI, it does not exist in Spokane. I felt this was the perfect way to avoid any of the conflicts that arise when writing about a real place.

Norm:

Are you working on any books/projects that you would like to share with us? (We would love to hear all about them!)

Thomas:

I am close to the end of my second novel, The Siren's Song. It is the story about a haunted pool that sits in the backyard of a mansion on the cliffs overlooking Santa Cruz, CA. I hope to have it done by the holidays of this year.

I am an avid football fan and have a novel about a number one draft pick who is the spoiled, crude athlete that we seem to be producing these days. In his contract, his agent adds a clause that gives power of attorney over the players entire fortune to a third party, should the player ever be suspended from the league. Of course, the player is suspended and the third party arbitrator turns out to be the players estranged father. He must now go back and work at his father's paving company until his suspension is up and he is reinstated. It is a father-son relationship novel called, In The Belly Of The Back.

In addition, I have the sequel to Justice Rules, Everything In Sight mapped out and hope to sit down and write that in the near future.

Norm:

Where can our readers find out more about you and Justice Rules?

Thomas:

I have a WEB SITE. On the site are many items of interest that include an expanded biography, a blog, some insights from my life and other bits of information. You can also link to the book from there.

Norm:

Is there anything else you wish to add that we have not covered?

Thomas:

I love writing. It is the perfect lifestyle for me at this point in time. Creating these stories and allowing them to come to life intrigues and energizes me in a way that is hard to explain. People get satisfaction from many different sources, for some it's a pay check, for others it's an athletic endeavor and still for some it's their family and friends; for me it's the creative process. All through my career I have been fortunate enough to work in circumstances that have allowed me to be creative. I have written and directed plays and videos, I have created themed meetings for corporate America and I have written novels and screenplays. Sometimes there is money that comes with these endeavors, which always amazes me, and sometimes there is not. My wife often reminds me that doing the ones that offer money is preferable. But, it is the act of creating that satisfies me most and in performing that act I am fulfilled. So even if no money comes at the end of my writing sessions, I still feel that I have been productive and that makes me happy.

Norm:

Thanks once again and good luck with all of your future endeavors